Metronome up to date

Paul Barker · Post by **Paul Barker** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 6:38 pm

Oh I see, so you don't need baffle step correction because of the behaviour of your box right?

Cressy Snr · Post by **Cressy Snr** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 6:54 pm

Paul Barker wrote:Oh I see, so you don't need baffle step correction because of the behaviour of your box right?

Yes and no really. It depends where you put the box.

The cabs are all specifically designed for boundary placement (WAF being their main raison d'etre) and rely heavily on the proximity of walls and floor to produce a balanced sound. The down firing port is supposed to excite the room's vertical mode in an attempt to keep the bass clean.

However some people, particularly in the USA where, of course, they have bigger rooms expressed a desire to have the speakers in free space so as to maximise depth in the stereo image. This lightened the balance considerably and emphasised the midrange and top, producing a hard, forward sound. The BSC correction is used where "away from walls" positioning is required and as you say brings up the bass and drops the top slightly to bring everything into line again.

Ironically the last Whitham was the first place I had managed to get my Mets positioned where they were intended to be placed; ie hard up against a wall. They of course sounded fine, within their loudness capability, even in the big room.

I don't get the best out of them at Steve's because they are so far out into the room and lose bass and body, becoming weak and shouty if pushed, but then again they image like crazy in his room, but it's artificial IMO because there's nothing underneath to anchor anything, therefore things get a bit ethereal, not much good for anything but the simplest stuff.

But positioned right they are a good speaker for what they were designed to do.

TBQH, away from walls, from what I have heard with Steve and Nick's speakers, one would be far better off with a decent open baffle than a Metronome, even a Metronome with BSC applied.

Here's Mr Bill Benuti's (Lousymusician on DIYAudio) five foot tall Hemptone 8inch driver Mets being used as the design intended.

Steve

Paul Barker · Post by **Paul Barker** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 8:42 pm

On the whole when using such as aer and lowther from what I can make out people prefer the sound without the bfs even though they need it for a flat(ter) response.

I have it on good authority that Lowthers (which are really voigts) were designed for use with front horns, which dealt with the issue. Using them in OB is wrong.

I am planning front horns on my OB's. What do I care what it looks like? It'll still be the prettiest thing in the room.

Cressy Snr · Post by **Cressy Snr** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:18 pm

Paul Barker wrote: I am planning front horns on my OB's. What do I care what it looks like? It'll still be the prettiest thing in the room.

Paul Barker · Post by **Paul Barker** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:03 am

By the way the bass with the floor to ceiling baffles is well worth it.

Post by **Nick** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:45 am

While you are in "looks no issue" mode Paul, maybe some studding and board the entire end of the room off (with an air tight door)?

What happens to a open baffle if it has no free edges?

steve s · Post by **steve s** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 11:05 am

Paul Barker wrote:On the whole when using such as aer and lowther from what I can make out people prefer the sound without the bfs even though they need it for a flat(ter) response.

I have it on good authority that Lowthers (which are really voigts) were designed for use with front horns, which dealt with the issue. Using them in OB is wrong.

I am planning front horns on my OB's. What do I care what it looks like? It'll still be the prettiest thing in the room.

.. the voigt corner reproducer was a front horn.. but not like you see in use today.. it had a around a 5' front horn and a bass reflex box for the bass...

the speaker needs some sort of loading when used on there own to balance the sound.. i found that with the varoius horns i've used in the past..
i was always going to put short front horns on my angel horns but never got around to it... and my lathe is not quite big enough for what i wanted.

the later drivers where not built for front loading, all the lowther plans/speakers are blh's

using horns on the front would/ could focus the mids and highs to balance any miss match in output with the bass driver there are lots of mechanical ways to get an even frequency response..

steve

Scottmoose · Post by **Scottmoose** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 11:48 am

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Paul Barker · Post by **Paul Barker** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:43 pm

The bay seller I bought my pm7a's from Mike seems to be well in with Lowther as he does reconing and any other work required using parts he buys from Lowther. He maintains that the design is still basically the same as the voigt and requires a front horn with a rear loading chamber as Scott said. Lowther have just missed the mark by persuing rear horns and by adapting their range to suit.

This guy doesn't like the (rediculous in his words) modern phase equaliser much prefers the stabiliser as seen on the PM4 which he says "loads the whizzer"

He is selling me some sand filled front horns which I recon can sit through the OB's

I am quite sure that geting the best out of lowthers involves long standing enthusiasts like this.

Scottmoose · Post by **Scottmoose** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:31 pm

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Cressy Snr · Post by **Cressy Snr** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 8:47 pm

A further update on the Metronomes.
I managed to get hold of a brand new Ruark Vita 50 subwoofer off a guy on eBay who seems to have picked up a few of these as end of line clearouts and has been slowly offloading them for £119 each. They are exactly the same sub as my present MJ pro 50 so at the price are something of a bargain. So now I can look forward at last to stereo bass.

Scott has been quietly badgering me for the past twelve months to go stereo at the low end with the Metronomes. I'm looking forward to hearing the results.

Steve

Scottmoose · Post by **Scottmoose** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:34 am

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Cressy Snr · Post by **Cressy Snr** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:39 pm

Well the extra sub arrived this lunch time and I have been enjoying the results of stereo bass all afternoon. There's no way I could go back to a mono subwoofer.

The soundfield in the room is more even and very little peakiness is left in the low end response. Paradoxically, although it is a well-known effect, the treble has become smoother and more extended with the addition of the extra bass channel. The soundstage is also further extended in both the depth and width planes and instruments and voices are solidly rooted within the soundscape. These factors taken together, give a greater sense of realism than with the mono sub. An additional benefit is a beautifully relaxed, less "busy" but more detailed sound from the system, probably due to the better headroom available at the bottom end.

Both subs connect to the 6336A amp speaker outlets via their the high level inputs, using Neutrik Speakon connectors, so we have 50wpc of active bass amplification below 200Hz - quite sufficient for a small room. The subs are placed in opposite room corners behind the main speakers, equidistant from the listening seat. The main speakers are placed about 30" in from each bass enclosure and about 9" from the rear wall. With this arrangement the sound and image quality in my room is maximised.

To be perfectly honest I was dreading having to set up the twin bass systems but it was surprisingly easy to get the subs integrated with the mains. Whether I'd be able to pull off the same trick at a fest, I wouldn't like to say.

Steve

Scottmoose · Post by **Scottmoose** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 11:02 pm

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andrew Ivimey · Post by **andrew Ivimey** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 11:20 pm

By 'stereo', Scott, I assume you mean two channel? As sub-bass is only a single channel (i.e mono), in what Steve is doing, coming from two sources.

audio-talk

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